I’ve been engaging in conversations around liberation in business for the REAL Uplevel Interview Series, and it’s been illuminating the consistent blindspots in the coaching, wellness, and healing industries. 

There are very real consequences when people with any kind of authority in these spaces view vast and global topics through their own micro-experiences. In this episode, I break down what some of those outcomes are, including upholding systems of supremacy and oppression and engaging in manipulative sales tactics.

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Join me as I pull back the curtain on my creation process for this series and share what topics we’ll be exploring with my guest speakers.

In episode 416 of the Embodied Podcast we discuss:

  • (1:33) Updates about the REAL Uplevel Interview Series: who you’ll hear from and what we discuss 
  • (7:29) How I plan to create the container and the agreements for this series  
  • (9:13) Concepts and quotes that really stood out for me from Alok Vaid-Menon’s episode on The Man Enough Podcast 
  • (14:08) A big area that I’m learning more about right now
  • (19:19) Alok’s deeper perspective on self-love
  • (23:45) Overlapping themes I’ve noticed in my interviews for the series 
  • (26:32) My experience of the ‘integrity effect’ as a coach 
  • (30:57) What inspired me to finally create this series
  • (35:15) Practicing humility 
  • (38:54) One of the most expansive parts of the series so far

Resources mentioned by Elizabeth in the episode:

Work with me:

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Quotes from this Week’s Episode of the Embodied Podcast: 

  • When we put ourselves out into the world with any kind of authority, or to share any kind of message or art or guide people in any kind of way, life will present us with opportunities to be accountable, to be congruent, and to more deeply embody our own work. 
  • Some of us are out here trying to be and bring more love to everything. And most people are not attuned to that level of love or compassion. Some people can’t fathom that we would have that much love or care or compassion for them, because they don’t have it for themselves and/or they’re super guarded or limited in their ability to receive it from even their closest people. 
  • I have this irrevocable, unshakable sense of who I am. I don’t need to be legitimized and I don’t have anything to prove. 
  • I’ve been observing for years how dangerous it is when people who need to be loved and liked, who are out to prove their worth, and who have a lot of unhealed trauma are given a platform and a whole bunch of money for branding and marketing.
  • I do find deep peace and acceptance in remembering that divine orchestration is far more intricate and complex than our human minds will ever be able to fathom.
  • Humility is soul balm because above all else, it’s rooted in the truth.
  • I lack a certain understanding, exposure, and depth with various groups of people. So my approach is to expose myself to those lived experiences and cultures, not by creating transactional interactions with people, but by reading, following, watching, taking in their stories, inviting them to conversations on the podcast, and to guest teach in my containers. Again, not in a consumptive or transactional way, but in a way that comes from a desire to feel, understand, value, and include them.

How was this episode for you?

Was this episode helpful for you today? I’d love to know what quote or lesson touched your soul. Let me know in the comments below OR share the episode on Instagram, tag me your stories @elizabethdialto, or send me a DM!

About the Embodied Podcast with Elizabeth DiAlto

Since 2013 I’ve been developing a body of work that helps women embody self-love, healing, and wholeness. We do this by focusing on the four levels of consciousness – physical, mental, emotional, and spiritual.

In practical terms, this looks like exploring tools and practices to help you tune into the deep wisdom of the body and the knowing of the heart, which I believe are gateways to our souls. Then we cultivate a new relationship with our minds that allows the mind to serve this wisdom and knowledge and soul connection, rather than override it, which is what many of us were taught.

If you’ve been doing self-help or spiritual development work for a while, these are the types of foundational things that often people overlook in pursuit of fancier concepts that often aren’t practical or sustainable. Here, we will focus on building these strong foundations so you can honestly and thoroughly embody self-love. If you’re feeling it, subscribe to the show, and leave us a review wherever you listen from. You can also keep up with show updates and community discussions on Instagram here.

Transcript for Episode 416 “On Cleaning Up The Coaching Industry“:

Elizabeth DiAlto  00:00

For anyone who does creative work, leadership, work, healing or coaching or anything like that, there is an integrity effect that happens when we put ourselves out into the world with any kind of authority, or to share any kind of message or art or guide people in any kind of way. Life Of course presents us with opportunities to be accountable, to be congruent, and to more deeply embody our own work.

Elizabeth DiAlto  00:30

Hello, everybody, welcome to episode number 416 of the embodied podcast. I’m your host, Elizabeth DiAlto. And I call this episode on cleaning up the coaching industry. And even if you’re not a healer or a coach, if you follow healers and coaches, which obviously you do, because you’re listening to this podcast, and I’m probably not the only person you listened to whether this is your first time tuning in, or the 416th time because you’ve listened to every episode. By the way, shout out to you. And a big thank you if this is your 416th time listening always makes me melt when people tell me they’ve listened to every episode, sometimes even more than once. But back to the topic at hand. I call it this on cleaning up the coaching industry. But this episode isn’t just about the coaching industry. The coaching industry overlaps with online business, health and wellness, and the healing industry as well. These are the overlapping industries I’m talking about. That’s just too much to put in the title of a podcast episode. 

Elizabeth DiAlto  01:33

So this episode also really takes you behind the scenes on the creation process of the real uplevel business interview series that I’m working on right now. That’s going to open for registration on March 30. And go live on April 3, I believe. If you are a coach or a healer you’re interested in that you can get on the interest list at untamed yourself.com, forward slash real uplevel. And I’m going to be talking about the series a lot throughout this episode. Because I like sharing my process with you all. Because my process is not formulaic. It’s intuitive and it’s mystical. It’s not fully planned out or controlled. Even though of course, there is some structure because there needs to be. But there’s also a lot of room for divine inspiration and intervention, for my soul’s wisdom to come through for my ancestors to help me out. And for my divine support squad to guide me. And divine support squad is just what I call all the divine beings that love me guide me protect me and support me unconditionally. 

Elizabeth DiAlto  02:37

The series isn’t going to be fancy, it’s not going to be highly produced. It’s going to be organized, though. But more than anything is going to be real, it’s going to be raw, it’s going to be truthful, it’s going to be useful. It’s also not going to be all inclusive, or extensively comprehensive. Because we’re talking about integrating and implementing liberatory practices, and business. And nobody has it all figured out. I have 16 speakers confirmed right now, with 18 on my list. I’m just waiting for those last two people to schedule their interviews, to be able to confidently call them confirmed because you never know. And I also know going into it that there are some topics that are big parts of liberation, that I was not able to find speakers to speak on. So there will be things that do need to be part of the conversation that will not be part of the series. So I’ll probably do a part two at some point. But this felt like enough. This felt like more than an ample place to start without overloading people. And also one of the things about all the people that I invited they’re all people either have some kind of pre existing relationship with some of them are like my dearest friends and my process partners. 

Elizabeth DiAlto  03:56

Like you’ll hear from Trudy LeBron, Louisa Duran, Atia Ramakrishna and Nisha Moogly, who for years have been people that I process a lot of this stuff with, and work on and work out a lot of this stuff with, for example. And then other people who were dear friends of mine, as he Spencer, Joe Coleman, I don’t have the whole list in front of me, those are not the only two, who I just respect over the years how I’ve watched them conduct themselves and their businesses in ways that are they perfectly liberatory No, but as anybody also know, none of us have this all figured out. And that said, it’s agitating to me that this is even needs to be emphasized. But it does me decided to create something around this by no means is any statement of my own being done doing my own work, or positioning myself as any kind of authority on the topic. In fact, as I do the interviews, one of the things I’m realizing is how much more work there is for me to do. Go figure and a lot of my guests are aren’t experts either some of them are. 

Elizabeth DiAlto  05:02

But what they are, across the board are folks who’ve been deeply integrating liberatory practices in their work for years. That’s what I’m super excited about. For anyone who feels like they don’t know what to do, what steps to follow, who wishes that they had a map for contributing, like how to contribute to collective healing and liberation through their business. That’s what this series is going to provide. You’re going to be able to hear from others how they’ve done it. other business owners who do not specialize in these things, but are doing it and doing it really well.

Elizabeth DiAlto  05:36

You’ll hear who they’ve learned from how they face the humility, shame and vulnerability at times, learn to deal with challenges found courage and compassion for and within themselves. For others. I’m also so excited. Another one of my dearest friends and people I process with all the time is Jessica fish, who’s been on the podcast, and her conversation. Her episode is one of our most popular episodes ever. It was about divesting from perfectionism and her business partner Deseret Attaway, who was one of my first teachers who introduced me to the liberatory consciousness framework that I love so much that we’ll talk about in the series. So this is going to be really deep, really juicy, really needed. So again, make sure you’re on that interest list and untamed yourself.com, forward slash real uplevel if you want the details as soon as that goes live. 

Elizabeth DiAlto  06:24

Now, another reason why I’m hosting this is to continue implementing what I’ve learned over the years, and what I’m continuing to learn, and also stay steady in my commitment to using my voice, to say unpopular things, things that might make people uncomfortable in these overlapping industries, that function largely by replicating and upholding systems of supremacy and oppression. I’m not doing this to judge or condemn anyone, but to invite those who care enough to make different choices, to make them and to offer insights, inquiry and space to do so. Because we all need processing space for this, we all need a place to work through this talk through this. And especially in a space where you will not be again judged, condemned, singled out, where people will focus more on the solutions than like picking you apart because you didn’t know something, which is really common and really popular, especially in online spaces that Do you know, social justice, decolonization, anti racism, liberation works and stuff like that.

Elizabeth DiAlto  07:29

So here’s what you might want to know about me as the host of this thing, and around how I plan to create the container and the agreements for it. I do not take issue on any level, with people being where they are in their learning, awareness, consciousness or evolution. I don’t take issue with people messing up or not knowing what they don’t know. What I take issue with and really hope to disrupt is people weaponizing, or leveraging their identities, and leveraging the language of liberation to make sales or to attract certain kinds of people. I take issue with intentionally manipulative or coercive virtue signaling, especially when people aren’t backing those things up with practice and integration. I take issue with people not walking their talk and refusing the lesson. I take issue with willful ignorance and lacks of curiosity and humility. And more than anything, I take issue with dehumanization. 

Elizabeth DiAlto  08:26

So as far as me hosting and producing this interview series, I’m mainly doing it because I just give a shit. I’m tired of a lot of this nonsense. And I’m also not afraid to mess up. I’m not afraid to be called in out or forward. As my Isha T Hill another one of our guests in the series calls it or to be responsible and accountable, or to do repair it for when I need to. Which brings me to this, you can’t make this shit up divine timing moment. Just today. I was listening to a Lok vaid Menon on the man enough podcast randomly this morning. Because a clip from the episode popped up on my Facebook timeline, it was about a 10 minute clip. And it was just nonstop gems. So I went to find the rest of the episode which is from 2021.

Elizabeth DiAlto  09:13

And it was called the urgent need for compassion. And I’m going to share with you in this episode some highlights from the episode with you. You could also get links to it at the show notes page at untamed yourself.com forward slash podcast. And so many of the things he was saying, were resonating so much with what’s been on my mind and on my heart as I’m doing this real uplevel interview series as I’m doing the interviews and as I’m planning the series. So one of the things Luke said was about how living is about gloriously messing up and how loving is about trying harder for each other. And I love that so much because all the interviews in the series and the couple of solo recordings and I’m going to do are really just providing us all with way Is that we can try harder for each other, and reasons to remember why we should. So those two statements that elope made, how living is about gloriously messing up and how loving is about trying harder for each other. I love them so much, because essentially, those have been my guiding principles in my personal life by self healing and liberation work over the last 13 years, as well as the more collective oriented healing and liberation work I’ve been doing for the last six or seven. 

Elizabeth DiAlto  10:31

A look also said, of people who have a hard time coming along with us, when we invite them to do that, that they don’t know how to feel love, like we can give. And that brought me into a deeper awareness about why liberation work is so hard. Some of us are out here trying to be and bring more love to everything. And a lot of people probably most people are not attuned to that level of love or compassion. Because that level of love comes with so much compassion. Some people can’t fathom that we would have that much love or care or compassion for them, because they don’t have it for themselves. And or they’re super guarded or limited in their ability to receive it from even their closest people

Elizabeth DiAlto  11:18

So why on earth would they accept it from people they don’t wear people they barely know. So one of the hosts of the man enough podcast, which I’ve never listened to before, his name is Jamie Heath. He’s a black man who shared with a bloke that he wondered why he doesn’t fight for elope and other trans people. And I give you the context that he’s a black man because he was relating. He was saying I can’t relate directly, but I can certainly relate with being oppressed. So he asked to look what he can unlearn and help other men unlearn, which is a big intention of that whole podcast to help men unlearn toxic masculinity, and teach them what to replace it with. And a logs response to Jamie was so beautiful, they said, the reason you don’t fight for me, is because you’re not fighting for yourself fully. And I’m gonna share more of what they said after that. But as I was listening to them, I was really connecting the dots for myself,

Elizabeth DiAlto  12:16

I don’t have a ton of trans or non binary people in my life, the ones I do are acquaintances, or people in my community, not anyone I know, very deeply or personally, or have a super deep relationship with. And that’s not by choice. I’ve never avoided trans people. But the nature of my circles has been pretty gender conforming. This made me think about something I shared in a recent episode about how some people really have like, no black people in their lives. And all they know about black folks comes from TV, music, movies, media, and entertainment. And that was something that I naively didn’t realize, till, like literally a couple of years ago, as a person who grew up in a border of New York City, I was exposed to a lot of cultures. So I’ve always had friends from all kinds of backgrounds, and not just acquaintances, but like close friends, like friends, who will tell me about the depths of their living experiences.

Elizabeth DiAlto  13:07

Because there’s a difference, by the way, a difference between having people in your life and having people in your life who share the intricacies of their lived experiences with you. You might know bipoc, folks, black, indigenous are people of color. But do they talk to you about what it’s like to be black in America, for example, or wherever you live? Have you sat with them in the wake of state sanctioned violence against their people, and listen to felt experienced their pain, fear, anger and grief, there’s a difference. And I’m just using, you know, certain groups of people as an example.

Elizabeth DiAlto  13:47

So I have that in my life in spades around race and ethnicity, where I haven’t less is around sexuality, and even less around gender. And as well, this has certainly increased for me over the years, especially, as I’ve learned more extensively, what disability like covers and includes, and how many invisible disabilities there actually are. 

Elizabeth DiAlto  14:08

But I also don’t have as many disabled folks in my life. So what I’m coming to realize lately, around another marginalized group is I do have a ton of neurodivergent people in my life. And also I am one. And our culture is so limited in its resources and understanding of neuro divergence that a lot of us are only coming to realize this about ourselves and about each other, later in life, right? Some people in their 30s and 40s. Some people have known this about themselves and had diagnoses since childhood. And there’s no better than or worse than around any of that. So that’s also a big area that I’m leaning into learning more about right now. And doing a lot of processing with friends who are also realizing you know, that they’re neurodivergent or who are also really just wanting to take the time and care to Make sure that their work is inclusive and supportive of neurodivergent people.

Elizabeth DiAlto  15:04

So I’m sharing all this because I lack certain understanding exposure and depth with various groups of people. So my approach is to expose myself to those lived experiences and cultures, not by creating transactional interactions with people in those communities are asking them to educate me, but by reading, following, watching, taking in their stories, inviting them to conversations on the podcast, and to guest teach in my containers, again, not in a consumptive or transactional way, but in a way that comes from a desire to feel understand value, and include them, because I was not socialized to do so growing up in a Catholic heteronormative family and an over culture. And no matter how you grew up, I know a lot of people also weren’t.

Elizabeth DiAlto  15:47

And I want to go back to a look, because there was something really amazing that they said, related to this, especially, even though I do have a desire to understand people, it’s not necessary to accept or love people, or have compassion for them, or care about their safety, as well. We don’t need to understand people, we don’t need to be able to walk in their shoes, to really give a shit, and to really put effort towards and stand up and stand with them, and their safety and their well being. So here’s a few more things that a Loke shared that I want to share with you. And I want to emphasize something here. If any of this resonates for you, and you go share it anywhere, please make sure you attribute it to a look not to me. I see this happening sometimes in the podcasts where I’m quoting someone else, which I always do very clearly. But people attribute what I said to me, not who I quoted. And I know that can be confusing sometimes. So really going to try to overemphasize what our looks where it’s here, not mine.

Elizabeth DiAlto  16:53

So here are more things that they said. People say that they want freedom, but they’re fighting for the right to oppress others. They don’t want freedom they want power. Privilege is the ability to do to other people, what was done to you. They also said, I think trans people can actually teach the world transition as possible, not just between genders, but between paradigms, it’s so possible to learn and to constantly be learning. And in fact, learning is the most delightful thing about being alive, that I loved so much. Learning is the most delightful thing about being alive. Because I certainly feel that way you might not agree. And that’s okay. A look also responded to Jamie the host by saying, and this is a paraphrasing, you really just should watch the interview the whole thing. A Luke said, don’t show up for me, because you want to protect me or help me. I don’t need your help. I have an unshakable an irrevocable sense of who I am. I don’t need to be legitimized. I don’t have anything to prove. Are you ready to heal? I don’t think the majority of people are ready to heal. That’s why they oppress us. They’ve done this violence to themselves first. So when they see us having the audacity to live a life without compromise, instead of saying thank you for teaching me another way to live. They try to disappear us because they did that to us first. Oh, because they did that first. So let me restate that part of what Luke said. Instead of saying thank you for teaching me another way to live. They try to disappear us because they did that first. So reframe the question to can you help me get free? Not? Can you help me help you? So when I look set all this, reframe the question to can you help me get free? Not Can you help me help you? All three hosts of that podcast, Liz plank, Jamie Heath and Justin Baldoni were speechless. And you could just feel it landing in the room with such immense gravity. Because what that does is that takes the savior complex that a lot of people have, but a lot of people who misunderstand what ally ship being a co conspirator or an accomplished, you know, whatever you want to call it being in solidarity is it’s not about saving people, 

Elizabeth DiAlto  19:19

a locus saying we do need to dismantle things outside of us. But we’re not gonna be able to do that if we don’t dismantle things inside of us. So there is that deeply personal part of all of this, where we have to do our own work on our own inner landscape. And this gave me a deeper perspective on self love to we can love ourselves, even with our wounds, shortcomings, quirks, etc. We have greater capacity for dismantling this stuff within ourselves. That is dismantle Rubble, when we dismantle it within ourselves. We don’t need to try to disappear it and other people, and I really appreciate it a loks phrasing, try to disappear it, because that’s what people are often trying to do make things go away. So they don’t have to look at them, or deal with them, or feel what they feel when faced with them. And there is an important distinction to be made here. Because, and this is the big intention of the real uplevel business interview series, there are some things that are worth disappearing, that should be disappeared. Those things are all forms of dehumanizing oppressive supremacist behavior, those things do need to go, we are not out here saying everything has a right to exist, everything should exist, everything has value. I am very clearly uncomfortable saying dehumanization, and oppressive supremacist behavior has got to go. And they need to go to create space for honoring everyone’s humanity, and for fostering and creating more safety for all of us, especially the most marginalized folks.

Elizabeth DiAlto  21:00

But something else a lot talked about in that interview, if again, just go listen to the damn interview. There’s a link in the show notes is that these things that we think only affect marginalized groups do not, they absolutely affect all of us on many levels that a lot of people don’t realize, and certainly can’t measure. 

Elizabeth DiAlto  21:19

So something I realized, as I was listening to this, and I was feeling super affirmed in not only my intentions and my approach, but just what I’ve implemented and integrated and learned and been doing over like the last six or seven years, especially, is that I’ve also been training for this for like a decade, I started interviewing people in 2013, I did a little YouTube series called in the hot seat with Liz de alto when I was still going by lists. And then in 2015, I started this podcast. So I’ve interviewed somewhere between 303 150 people at this point. And I now have a specific set of skills. What’s the movie Taken? When Russell Crowe was like, I have a specific set of skills. I’m not out here like killing bad guys and rescuing people like that. 

Elizabeth DiAlto  22:06

But curating interviews and conversations around important topics, is a special set of skills that I have now. I’m also really curious, really humble. And when I say really humbly, that sounds like a weird, like almost a contradictory thing to be like, I’m really humble. What I just mean is I come at these things with humility, I come at these things, fully accepting and knowing that there’s so much I don’t know, that likely in every conversation, which by the way, this has happened. I did six of the interviews so far. And in every conversation, I was like, damn, didn’t know that damn, haven’t been doing that. Damn, I could be way better at that. So it’s what I mean by humble, right? Just just totally knowing that there’s all kinds of shit, I don’t know. Or even some of the things I do know I’m not doing particularly well, are things that I could have probably implemented by now already. I haven’t for whatever reason. And so when I say humble, I mean, I’m not making excuses for myself. It just is what it is.

Elizabeth DiAlto  23:01

I’m also really interested in deepening my own knowledge, understanding practices, consciousness and awareness. And the biggest truth, though, is that kind of like when a look was saying, I have this irrevocable, unshakable sense of who I am, I don’t need to be legitimized. And I don’t have anything to prove. That’s how I feel. I’m here for collective healing and liberation, I’m not here for you to like me, I’ll need you to save me in the areas in which I am marginalized, or other. And I also don’t mind being rejected. If you’re like, fuck this chick, I want to listen to her. That’s fine.

Elizabeth DiAlto  23:45

Now, if there’s anything I’ve noticed, is this huge thing across the overlapping industries we’re talking about here is how dangerous it is when people whose needs to be loved and liked, who were out to prove their worth are when given a platform and a whole bunch of money for branding and marketing. So let me say that again, I’ve been observing for years, how dangerous it is, when people whose needs to be loved and liked, who are out to prove their worth. And I’ll also add who have a lot of unhealed trauma, and really active wounds, how dangerous these people are, when given a platform and a whole bunch of money for branding and marketing.

Elizabeth DiAlto  24:26

So some of you are probably aware of this, you’ve probably seen it in action. Maybe after listening to this and listening to that podcast with a look on man enough, you’ll be better at spotting it. That’s another intention of the real up level interview series is the same way when we heal from other things, right, like I’ve talked about on the podcast for years healing from codependency and how one of the things related to that is eventually being able to really spot all kinds of red flags. I didn’t used to and all kinds of green flags that didn’t even register to me in the past as green flags. So through these interviews and conversations, I hope to help you cultivate that around your own liberatory consciousness.

Elizabeth DiAlto  25:15

Now, there’s a story I was going to share with you. But I’m actually recording this later on in the evening. And I’m running out of energy for it. So I’m going to skip over that. And I’m really just telling you that. So I have time to scroll through my notes here. What I will go to is sharing how rampid it is in the coaching industry, that people will assess things that are very vast and very global, only based on their own micro experiences. This reminds me of I dated someone who was a coach. And he used to say things like, I’ve worked with the most amazing teachers in the world. And I’d be like, how do you know that there are 7 billion people in the world, you know how many of the best teachers probably don’t even have websites, or access to resources to get their work out in the world to be found. And what this is called is myopia. Google defines myopia as lack of imagination, foresight, or intellectual insight. And there’s a lot of this in the coaching industry, because there’s a lot of inflated senses of self constructed and delusional senses of self and importance and authority.

Elizabeth DiAlto  26:32

So this gets into some of the deeper nuances of leadership coaching and healing. And again, I’m, that’s another intention of the real uplevel interview series. Because here’s something that is true. More often than not, for anyone who does creative work, leadership, work, healing, or coaching or anything like that. There is an integrity effect that happens when we put ourselves out into the world with any kind of authority, or to share any kind of message or art or guide people in any kind of way. Life will, of course, presents us with opportunities to be accountable, to be congruent, and to more deeply embody our own work. It almost always happens. It’s uncanny. So, for example, as I kicked off this year, with several episodes, about liberation, guess what places where I need to go deeper into my own liberation, where it had been illuminated in my life, and are continuing to be illuminated in my life. My friend, Asha, Ramakrishna, who is in the real uplevel interview series, and she has been on the podcast before talking about sacred commerce. I talked to her last week. And I’ll share a little bit more about our topic later in this episode. And she made this beautiful post, and I’m gonna share it with you highlights an important difference between personal liberation and collective liberation.

Elizabeth DiAlto  27:55

And one of the things I love most about Asha, first of all, she’s in her 50s. And I crave the wisdom of women who are older than me. And she’s not that much older than me, I’m 39. But she’s also softer than me, I’m more fierce. So sometimes we check in with each other when we need a bit of the others medicine. So when I need a softer approach, I call Asha, when she needs to dial up some fierceness, she calls me. And that’s not to say I’m a soft in my own right, but she’s not fierce in her own right, but will often like dip in to the others more natural or more resource supply of that. So here’s what Asha wrote in her post. And this was a public post. So it’s okay to share. And again, I want to emphasize, if you share any of this, make sure you attribute it to Asha, please, not me. So these are her words. What happens when our personal liberation causes harm to others? It’s a thing. Some people don’t give a shit about the aftermath of their liberation, because they’ve endured a fat ton. And they’re tired of babysitting other people’s feelings, I get that. And also, some of us don’t want to be jerks in the human realm. Even though the spirit realm downloads liberation moves to us. I’m on the camp, that we could be both liberated and tend in right relationship to other humans. This means we have to refine and purify our energy so that we can have conversations that are not fun, but that repair community. I’ve had situations in my life where world renowned trauma experts find themselves without the skills to have hard conversations. Maybe they don’t care, which is cool. And also it’s such a reminder that there is a more beautiful path of healing that does not require building walls and thinking their boundaries. And that was a quote Asha was quoting our friend wheeze. She continues, the refinement of our energy is beginning is the beginning of having clear, honest, curious leaning conversations that speak truth with love. Actual love, not pretend live on delivery. Should path we can both be free and aware of our impact. It’s next level. And yes, we can do this. The so that’s the end of OSHAs quote there. 

Elizabeth DiAlto  30:09

So the fact is that some people will always be more oriented towards themselves than the collective. And listen, that just is what it is. We don’t need to be mad at those people, we don’t need to make them wrong, we don’t need to judge them. But it’s just good to know. That’s not my orientation. And like a lot of things, I have strong opinions about it. But what really matters most is that there are a lot of things that explain why some people might be that way. And what none of those things do though, even if they’re the most intense trauma is excuse people from the harm they cause, or the ways in which their ABCs actions, behavior and choices, uphold and replicate systems of oppression and supremacy. Now on a spiritual note here, really from an Akashic perspective, we really have no way of knowing what anyone else’s soul contracts are. 

Elizabeth DiAlto  30:57

When I think about the person whose actions, behaviors and choices were the straw that broke the camel’s back for me, that inspired me to finally create this series, even though the idea for it really started to percolate for me in 2018, who knows, maybe part of her contract or part of our contract was to clash. So this series could come into being, I don’t know, and I don’t need to know.

Elizabeth DiAlto  31:20

But I do find deep peace and acceptance in remembering that divine orchestration is far more intricate and complex than our human minds will ever be able to fathom. I have another example of a coach that I worked with many years ago, his name is Jesse elder. And there was a specific way of doing a sales conversation sales like intake call with prospective clients that he taught at the time, I don’t know if he’s still teaching it. And included in his approach was a fast acting bonus. And I don’t mind incentivizing people to take action in a way that’s appropriate with an aligned with their own decision making processes. However, this wasn’t that this was one of those, like, if you make the decision, right now, the price is this, if you call me tomorrow, the price goes up to whatever. And in some cases, the price would go up by like 2500 $5,000. And you’re like, Damn, it’s expensive to not make this decision right on the spot. And you’re not everyone is built to make decisions right on the spot. 

Elizabeth DiAlto  32:22

And a lot of coaches will say that that’s about not being committed, or playing small, but and for my human design geeks out there. I’ve even learned this about myself. I’m a very decisive person, but I’m emotional authority. So I need at least a night to sleep on stuff, if not a couple of nights. And in some cases, even after a couple of nights, I still don’t know. So that has to be my answer. My answer then has to be I don’t know, where I don’t know right now, I can’t decide yet. Right. So I’m actually one of those people who is not built to make decisions on the spot. But I spent a lot of my life thinking I needed to, in response to this kind of pressure, these kinds of tactics and strategies. So I learned this approach from Jesse. And I was doing it, I was doing it for a while for like the greater part of 2015. And then into 2016, although into 2016, I started to make some adjustments to it, because it really just didn’t feel right to me. But I also was still kind of doing it, and was not yet totally unhooked from him. And there’s consequences for that. Ended up with a few people in programs that really shouldn’t have been in those programs.

Elizabeth DiAlto  33:35

I also had an experience with a woman who was an acquaintance of mine, who applied to work with me. And using that approach left her feeling like I just wanted her money. She shared that with me later. And the way she shared it with me was in a really like defensive yucky way of letting me know she’s like, by the way, I found someone who is a better fit, and they charge even more than you do. But the reason she felt compelled to be that way with me, is because I did that fast acting bonus shoot with her first. And I had a conversation with her, again, using the tactics that I learned from Jesse, like answering and handling her objections that was really putting it on her that not making the decision sooner or not knowing was something wrong with her, rather than which was just the truth. She was a fucking resonating with me. And why should she have been when I was using an approach like that? So maybe that was my role to play with her so she could find that other coach that was a better fit for her who knows.

Elizabeth DiAlto  34:40

After that interaction, though, the seed was planted for me that that approach was not super aligned with how I wanted to be engaging with people. At the time though I was in an echo chamber when I started. When I shared that with Jesse, by the way, how I handle that and how she responded. I was commended for calling her into a higher place and told it wasn’t my fault that she didn’t want to answer that call, that she didn’t want to like, step in and step up. That wasn’t right. That wasn’t true. Took me a while to unhook from that. But within a few months I was out of that container, I was realizing that like, that was not the person for me, because I knew I didn’t want those kinds of relationships or interactions or experiences with people. 

Elizabeth DiAlto  35:15

So anyway, oftentimes in coaching, in this industry, in these overlapping industries, that’s that’s what gets put on people that are playing small, they’re not stepping up, or this is their self esteem or their lack of self love. If you loved yourself, you would dot dot dot, that’s not always true. In 2020, I took a seat. For a lot of the year meeting, for the first time in five years, I pause the podcast, I had not taken a break, I have not skipped a week in five years. And I took off eight months, that year. And I didn’t do it. Because I was lacking self esteem. It wasn’t because I wasn’t I didn’t want to take up space, I wasn’t playing small. It just came from a place of not needing to be centered in everything, respect for the collective, that there were bigger, more important things going on than just me. And I really just had such a sense that year that like, my voice is not really what’s needed in a lot of what’s going on out here. So I took a break from the podcast.

Elizabeth DiAlto  36:13

So we get to do things like that without making it mean things that they don’t mean, as well being able to admit when you’re wrong, that you messed up, or you didn’t know something is great. Again, we talked about humility a little bit earlier, humility is soul balm. Because above all else, it’s rooted in the truth. People who think they need to hit the mark all the time, or that that’s even possible, who thinks that they need to be the best, most brilliant make the most money, be the most famous, have the most followers or do the most extravagant things are on a level more often than not proving their worth? And listen, I say more often than not, because some people are just extra 10. That’s just how they’re fucking built. Right?

Elizabeth DiAlto  36:51

Humility knows there’s nothing to prove. There’s a difference between proving and expressing. And that’s what I’m talking about. When I say some people are just extra, people are just extra, that’s their expression. They can’t contain it or control it, nor should they, but the people who are doing that to appear a certain way that’s proving expressing comes through it doesn’t need to be announced. Proving is only announcements, performances, positioning and curated demonstrations. Same as another like kind of buzzy term in the coaching industry in those overlapping industries in that world is being unapologetic. Being an apologetic isn’t just about taking up more space accepting your muchness or allowing yourself to receive all that’s meant for you. It’s also about deeply tending to what’s yours to do. It’s about using the gifts that you’ve been given, saying the things that only you can say, creating the things that only you can create, and not in the name of capitalism, productivity are outdated measures of success.

Elizabeth DiAlto  37:48

Some of you might remember I shared one of my words for this year is unapologetic, but it’s not about taking up space. It’s not about like, doing whatever the fuck I want. And if you don’t like it, fuck it. Like, it’s not that. It’s finding like the nooks and crannies, the places and spaces where I’ve still been behaving in a way that is apologetic. It reminds me of the title of Sonia Renee Taylor’s book, the body is not an apology. That’s like where am I very subtly or in ways being apologetic with my energy, my presence, my desires, my wild dreams, what I’m here to do in the world, where am I dialing it down? Or not fully expressing for reasons that don’t have to do with protecting my peace or conserving my energy? 

Elizabeth DiAlto  38:33

You know, so, one of these upcoming weeks, maybe it’ll be next week. It might be a few weeks after that sometime before the real uplevel series goes live in April, we’ll talk more about outdated measures of success, and how I’m weaving, creating new measures that are on our own terms into every conversation of the real up level series. There’s actually been one of my favorite things about the interview so far. I’m drawing on something I’ve talked about on the podcast before this framework that I haven’t named yet the four S’s, sufficiency, sustainability, soulfulness, and satisfaction. I’m asking all of our guests to comment on how they approach integrate, embody those things in their life and in their work. And people’s answers are just blowing me open, right? Because I think about those things only the way I think about them. So without giving too much framing or context to hear how people receive them and orient think about them is probably one of the most expensive parts of the conversation so far.

Elizabeth DiAlto  39:34

So again, I know I’m talking a lot about this series that I’m creating might not be relevant for everybody. But if you’re interested, go to untamed yourself.com forward slash real uplevel get on the interest list. And as well, because I’m sending out like longer emails and articles and some short videos and stuff between now when the series starts in April, since you know, we’re still a little less than two months out, so you’ll be getting some special stuff. When you join that interest list that I don’t share. Are anywhere else either so hope you enjoy this. Share it up on the socials at Elizabeth D Alto is my Instagram if you want to email us hello and untamed yourself.com with your thoughts instead, because you’re more private person that totally works. And we’ll be back next week. See you later.